I’ll admit that I’m a pretty poor excuse for a Christian. My faith tends to run hot and cool depending on which family member or friend is sick.
But even though a hypocrite I may be..and openly profess my doubt about “all the things that you’re liable to read in the Bible” not being necessarily so..I would never have the nerve to openly deny Jesus Christ as the Son of God and Savior of the world.
That’s pushin’ it bub.
As Hemmingsen and I sat together on the Big News set, he would occasionally say some outlandish things during commercial breaks regarding religion. I would jokingly slide my chair back away saying I didn’t wish to be caught up as collateral damage from the bolt of lightening that was about to strike him down.
I’ve always been a “I’ll believe what I want to believe..you do the same..or don’t believe in anything at all and leave it at that” kind of guy. But then I saw this big billboard up at Russell and Minnesota in Sioux Falls, paid for..I guess..by the atheists to promote their convention in town.
Okay..to be honest, the sight of seeing Jesus holding a jackalope caught me off guard and a guilty chuckle came over me. But then, so did the thought that hey, that’s not really fair.
That’s my guy up there and you’re suggesting he’s as mythological as a jackrabbit with antlers. He never existed and if He did, certainly never rose from the dead after the Romans had the good sense to torture and kill Him for causing such a stir.
This Man whose short life on earth was devoted to others offering healing and hope has left an eternal legacy that now encompasses 2.2 Billion of the world’s population.
Surly not all 2.2 billion of them have been duped into Christendom by contriving church leaders throughout history, fear mongering Bible beaters, money grubbing televangelists or phony faith healers. Certainly a lot of them have made intelligent decisions regarding their Christian faith and found it to be as fulfilling, rewarding, comforting and inspiring as promised.
Well, you’re never going to convince the atheists, of course. But, “Be not deceived, God is not mocked.” (Atheists love it when you throw a little scripture at ‘em. That’s Gal. 6:7..by the way.)
I don’t even know why they have conventions unless it’s just to walk around patting each other on the back saying how smart they are not to fall for all of that God is Love sh*t. I see they have quite a line-up of speakers with every diversity..cultural and otherwise..well represented.
I suppose you might think I could be promoting the event simply by mentioning it here. Nah. It’s been sold out for a while.
Cory Heidelberger, who’s married to a Lutheran minister, has been promoting the event on his blog.
Boy they must have some interesting conversations around the dinner table.
35 Responses
Hi – You asked why we have conventions, and I’d love to answer that.
We have no intent of walking around patting each other on the back and telling ourselves we’re smart. Actually, the speakers will be talking about building community, feminism, critical thinking, diversity, and issues that should be an interest to all of us. Because it’s about a lot more than just not believing in a god, it’s believing that humanity has to solve it’s issues on it’s own, so we need to figure out how. We are there to learn, to have fun, to socialize, and to network.
If you care to stop by and see what it’s about, I’d be more than happy to hook you up with a ticket.
Being an atheist takes much more courage, criticism, and strength than being a Christian, I admit! However, there’s much more freedom in it than some people will ever get to know! Why do we have conventions, you ask? For one, it gives atheists a break from the Christian influence we never cease to run into. While there are protests at Planned Parenthood, 40 Days of Life at many churches, and an entire music festival, Lifelight, dedicated to indoctrinating more born-again suckers, we don’t have a formal gathering in this state dedicated to freethought, skepticism, and reason–until now!
SkepDakota will be a welcome addition to an ever-growing population of a younger generation who may be in the closet or on the fence about leaving their forced faith coming from their parents and communities. We need this in this conservative, church every six blocks, corrupted state! We are some of the nicest people you’ll ever meet! We are for human rights, equality, freedom of choice, and keeping church out of government! And…there’s no crappy worship music like in that other convention!
Man created God in his own image, that is why each group of People has a little different image of God. Basically God is the conscience of Mankind and it is time Religion evolved from the old Mythical thinking that some supreme creator made man and has laid out a divine plan for the universe. It is time for mankind to become responsible for their own actions and the future of mankind. I am most skeptical of anything that claims to be the only way that is based on Blind Faith. Some people assume that everyone who belongs to a group religious or non-religious thinks the same, most do not, everyone has their own personal belief system. Some believe God created the universe, I happen to believe Man created God in his attempt to understand the universe and it’s many mysteries. Now if God is really another form of intelligent life, why would we assume that he, she or it is alone (only one God)? The universe is vast we don’t know anymore about it than the fish in our aquariums know about us or even how their fish food mysteriously appears on the top of the water each day.
There are a lot of reasons Atheists have conventions. Patting ourselves on the back for making fun of people doesn’t even make the list.
Yes, there are Atheists who doubt the existence of an actual historical Jesus figure, but there are as many others who believe Jesus was not only a real person, but was a pretty OK guy.
There are still tickets available (just no VIP tickets), but, hey. I’ll tell you what. I know you have never been to a convention like this and I’m pretty sure you have never heard of most of the speakers coming to SkepDakota. (They are all pretty great – though my personal favorite is JT Eberhard.) If you wanted to come down to the convention and listen to a few speakers and see what all the fuss is about, I invite you, Doug Lund, to come as my personal guest. That way you can have an informed opinion about what is behind the purely for shock value advertising. Plus, it will be nice to reconnect with someone I used to load groceries for at Econofoods many years ago.
I don’t know exactly about this convention Doug, but I can suggest why they might be doing more than patting each other on the back for not falling for God is Love. Can you understand why comic book fans have conventions? First of all, they are a community of people and want to meet others like them which could involve reaffirming and questioning their beliefs with each other. They will likely find information and speakers that interest them and that will be tailored to their beliefs. Doesn’t seem too hard for me to imagine. And as for never convincing atheists – who have you been talking to? I’d love to be convinced, I really truly would. But what kind of tangible evidence would you present to me that Jesus wasn’t just a human being that had a revolutionary philosophy (none of it new) which was later embellished by magic stories? Are you really going to point to the Gospels – second hand accounts that were written decades after Jesus was supposedly alive – as reliable proof he was this all powerful being, born of a virgin to save the planet? All religions have magical and mythical stories – surely you don’t believe in all of them do you? Have you ever seen or heard of anyone walking on water or throwing thunderbolts that you didn’t have to take on someone’s word? Don’t you find that highly suspicious? Maybe the reason you will never convince me is not because we are unreasonable, but you are. You believe in something for which there are plenty of reasons to believe is mostly fabricated and that there is no solid reason to believe is at all real unless you think adding up all the millions of other brainwashed people who were raised as children to never question this belief for fear of going to hell is a perfectly logical reason. I would say to that, people have been brainwashed to believe in all kinds of religions for thousands of years before Christianity and they have brainwashed to believe Islam and other religions since then. There is nothing new or special about it, it is all the same game with a different names. Christianity was adopted by the Roman Empire, the same culture we adopted much of our traditions and way of living and the same culture that has now been exported around the world. I’m not saying I’m surprised that people believe in religion because it seems that through history and pre-history people have had gods and superstitions that they used to explain things – what is amazing to me is how even in today’s world people are so threatened by those that don’t. Your blog post is a fair example. I’m sure there will be plenty of comments to further prove it.
I’m assuming that this is your opinion?
Hi! I just thought I’d let you know why we have conferences! It’s to discuss the many issues impacting all of us-the religious and the non-religious-and learn about ways to deal with and ultimately work toward resolution of those problems!
I’m so glad you noticed the diversity of our speakers! We are a diverse group. Shedding “faith” in a supernatural being doesn’t have race or gender limitations! We are all affected by the ills and good of religion-because whether we want it in our lives or not, it’s everywhere!
And it most certainly IS possible that 2.2 billion people have been duped! Religion is the ultimate sell! You’re promised eternal bliss and reuniting with your dead loved ones in the afterlife! You’re promised forgiveness and restoration no matter how many times you “sin”! You can both pray to god for a specific outcome-and enjoy the fact that it is all in his plan and the outcome is predetermined! It’s a wonderful world of paradox, hypocrisy, and the best and most un-testable reward system ever constructed! Religions of all stripes have done an excellent job of selling these rewards to the masses!
Jesus holding a jackalope was a great way to get attention and advertise the conference. People in our community and everywhere need to know-non believers exist; we live healthy and happy and productive lives right alongside all of you! And we are here when you’re ready to live firmly planted in reality!
All atheism means, is that we believe in one less god than you. No need for facetious comments, Mr. Lund.
I would not say that mankind was duped into believing in God except perhaps for political or financial gain. Religion has been used to take advantage of believers to support a cause which may or may not have resulted in bloodshed. However some traditions have been handed down for generations without question or thought to what was the original purpose behind such behavior and/or does it still apply today. When something is handed down from generation to generation by the people we respect and trust it is easy to keep an idea alive that has not challenged our thinking or created a problem for us. Before we had scientific methods to prove or disprove a belief some foods like pork may have been excepted as evil because it became a health problem when improperly prepared. When faced with a crisis or a problem people want answers and Religion was the original source for those answers right or wrong. Those religious views that followers are not allowed to question can be a danger to society as a whole especially when non-believers are condemned to death. Religious history is filled with hate, death and destruction in the name of God.
I suppose you also believe Islam is true because of its 1.6 billion adherents, and Hinduism with 1.1 billion.
One trunk, many braches. I’d suspect atheism has a leaflet somewhere in those twigs. Very heavy stuff. I Thank the Gods that be Jackalope season opens tomorrow in Wisconsin. While sitting in my stand I think I’ll think about writing a short story entitled “The Passion of Doug.” Let me know when the whippings end. Quite a response as was the first one.
Doug, I would sincerely like you to join us as a welcome guest! I believe if you saw what our convention is about, you would not just assume we do it to pat ourselves on the back. It is absolutely and most definitely NOT about that. Most of life’s core issues are typically addressed by religious institutions of some kind, or at least have been in the past. It truly is a great way to hear these people who are so well versed, speak about topics in a secular format! Religion is some how connected to almost everything in our daily lives. It is a welcoming thought to know you can escape if and be around those of like mind ever for a day.
Also on a different note, the more we put ourselves out there for the public to see, to say that dreaded word, ATHEIST, the more light that word will some day feel. If it’s not such a stigma, an unknown to be feared, people won’t need to hide their non-belief in fear for their lives in other parts of the world.
Got to love how atheists feel free to mock faith but get butt hurt when they are mocked
I have talked to Atheists, trying to be open minded, but was only ridiculed for being a true believer. I see it in these posts also, I am the sucker who is dumb enough to be duped by belief in a supernatural being. It gives me hope and honestly I don’t know if I would want to live without hope.
To Eyeroll,
I didn’t really see much “butt hurt” in the responses. I thought most were being quite respectful in explaining why we atheists have conventions. Sorry that the presence of atheists talking about what they do offends you so much.
To Hank,
Sorry that you felt ridiculed by the atheists that you have encountered, truly. As an atheist in a religiously dominated culture, I know how that feels. I feel that nothing good comes from ridiculing others because of their beliefs or lack of beliefs,
Wow!! Poked the hornets nest there, didn’t you Doug? Be careful, next thing you know there will be no after Thanksgiving sales of Christmas trees. Pretty sure atheists don’t buy Christmas presents for their children, and each other – they buy ‘holiday gifts’!
As a former Catholic and current atheist who practices Soto Zen Buddhist meditation, I have attended a variety of conventions over the years; most of them, though, have been teacher and literary scholarship conventions (and therefore connected to my profession). Free thinking, skepticism, atheism, and so forth are, like other “movements” (if I may use that word) concerned with much more than just a disbelief in a god or gods and the promotion of a secular perspective. Freethinkers, just like Christians, Jews, Buddhists, and others, are also concerned with issues involving social justice and environmental justice (which can also include ethical eating and animal welfare), as well as other issues that involve a democratic society: free-speech and a free press, racism, the rights of Native peoples, gender and transgender rights, women’s rights, pollution and global warming, education, poverty and homelessness, domestic violence, and the role of religion in public life. (For instance, like Western Buddhist converts, freethinkers are likewise faced with how much of their political and activist identities will, and should, be connected to their free thinking rather than connected to their party affiliation. Therefore, they are faced with the conundrum of whether or nit to politicize their free thinking identity.) Many other reasons exist for why freethinkers have conventions, including to socialize, to discuss books and science and any other intellectual or popular topic of interest.
I think the image of Jesus holding a Jackalope highlights the skeptical inquiry nature of a rethinking conference. Over the years, I have met Christians, both Catholic and Protestant, who have questioned, doubted, and even denied the theological realities of the Virgin Birth, the celibacy and singleness of Jesus, the bodily resurrection of Jesus, and even his Second Coming (and this doesn’t even touch such other thorny issues, such as the Transubstantiation of the Eucharist, the pointlessness and perpetual virginity of Mary, or whether Heaven, Purgatory, and Hell are physical places or states of existence.) Historically, going back to the Late Antique world, both so-called “orthodox” and so-called “heretical” Christians have even denied that Jesus was crucified (an idea that must have influenced Muhammad as it also appears in Al-Qu’ran) and that Jesus died in his third decade. And as a Buddhist practitioner, I am comfortable with the scholarly hypothesis that Shakyamuni Buddha never existed, and that he could have been a literary fiction created by monks and nuns to be the eponymous mouthpiece for a heretical and divergent form of Hinduism. If the ethical teachings of a religion are beneficial (and therefore true to a certain degree) it shouldn’t really matter if the teacher the teachings are ascribed to never lived, or was an amalgamation of quasi-historical, legendary, mythical, and historical individuals.
And I always told Doug not to worry about a “bolt of lightning,” that it was slower than that. I think I was correct.
If there is this God that most believe in, he has a sense of humor. Just look around you. Men and women both have brains, the best in the universe as far as we know, yet most of today’s thinking is glandular.
Now, Doug, you’ll want to push your chair back for this one. I think Earth is God’s reality channel. After a busy day of “forgiving,” he kicks back and tells St.Pete: “Put on that Earth thing we created. Let’s see what those idiots are up to today. It’s always good for a laugh.”
Duck Dynasty has nothing on Planet Earth.
To Billijak,
Some of us celebrate Cristmas and buy presents for children. Some of us buy Christmas presents for children we’ve never met and never will meet.
And in case you were wondering, to my knowledge and contrary to what you may have heard none of us have horns, none of us have fangs, and we don’t eat babies.
If you have any other questions about atheists (because you’ve already been thinking a lot about what we do on holidays) feel free to ask. I’m sure any atheist that has responded here can give you a better idea than the ones that you’ve heard from other sources.
Hi Doug………..very interesting comments. I am so thankful that God is my heavenly Father, Jesus is my High Priest/Savior and the Holy Spirit is my guide. Jesus said if you love me you will keep my commandments. If people kept His commandments there would not be all this craziness in the world. The front of the Bible starts in Eden and the middle of the Bible is the devil/satan messing up God plan for humanity. Now the back of the Bible shows how we return to Eden renewed.
When Jesus returns to earth, there will be two sides…………one where you believe in the triune God and follow the Holy Word or the otherside where you follow the the devil and world tradition. God gives all of us a choice and we alone are responsible for our choices. All of us will be on one side or the other. Choose wisely!
To add to Faithful,s comments, it will be for eternity.
Wow! What an interesting conversation. Looks like we all have a hard time avoiding judging others. I don’t have much to say about any conventions – atheist, Christian or other – but I did want to respond to something Jerrald Zeigler said in the early comments, “Being an atheist takes much more courage, criticism, and strength than being a Christian…” It may feel like that to you Jerrald, but as a Christian who struggles with, and am often embarrassed by, what is being done and said and protested in the name of Christianity, I find it also takes much strength and courage to continue following in the way of Christ. The assumptions made about who and what Christians are is probably not much different than assumptions made about atheists. I see a few of the assumptions about Christians in some of the comments, and I assure you we are not all of the same cloth, just as atheists are not. I’d sure love if we all had more respect for each other, regardless of our beliefs. Our world is really missing that right now.
To Trevor,
To answer your curiosity, I really wasn’t wondering about what you thought, but I re-read my comments carefully looking for the section on horn wearing, fang sharpening, and baby eating – and couldn’t find that part of my comments.
And no, I don’t spend a lot of time thinking about atheists and their holiday beliefs – there are way more important things to do with my waking hours, so I don’t have any other questions for you – or other non-believers.
But, a big ‘Thank-you’ for helping out with gifts at the Christmas Season, (btw I see you capitalized Christmas (sp?)).
I think the convention is held to celebrate the deterioration of culture and lack of respect for life that is going on in America. In the country of the world where I work, Madagascar, they call atheists “witch doctors”. They do not believe in anyone except themselves and they destroy people by making themselves a god. The people in this country are flocking to Jesus Christ who died for their distorted understanding of life, forgives them and offers a new way of living. Of course all people are by nature sinful and self centered, and Christians are not perfect, but they know they are not and thanks be to God, redeemed. So, I will inform the Christians in Madagascar of your convention and ask them to pray that the evil spirits which seeks to control every person’s life may be driven out of your small, self centered view of life.
WHEN ATHEISTS GO INTO THE WORLD BUILDING HOSPITAL AND CLINICS AND SERVE THE POOR OF THE WORLD IN THE MUD BRICK VILLAGES AND THE MOST DEPRESSED HOT AND HUMID JUNGLES THEN THEY CAN BOAST OF THEIR SUPERIOR BELIEVES . IN THE MEANTIME SWOLLEN EGOS PRETEND TO UNDERSTAND ALL THERE IS TO UNDERSTAND OF WHAT CAN BE SEEN AND OF WHAT CANNOT BE SEEN. WILLING IGNORANCE CAN BE CONFORTABLE .
I am going to the community. I’m a mostly closeted atheist because I don’t know how people would feel about me not believing. For the first time in a long time I’ll be surrounded by people with similar beliefs and I don’t have to hide who I am or what I believe. I wish I could go to something like this every weekend. People who go to church have an instant community, atheists don’t have the same outlet.
John 3-16
Atheist often feel a lack of community, which is why conferences like this happen. We are very much an excluded group in many circles. And hey, while that sucks it isn’t new and we aren’t the only group that has experienced this. But it is true.
Just these last few days we have seen prominent voices on the political right start to blame shootings and murders on atheism. This, to me, sounds very much like the same type of rhetoric aimed at The Jewish People or the LGBTQ community. This is another reason why we need to have clubs, have conventions, and create a sense of community. No one else is going to do it for us. We have to stand up for ourselves. This seems profoundly American to me.
I feel the real question is:What do you say to an atheist when they sneeze?
Denny,
Try “Best wishes on your evolutionary trek”
I wish I could have attended SkepDakota this year. I was really sad to have missed out. I hope everyone who attended had a great time and made progress!
If many of you read the bible, I am confident that you will be appalled by some of the lessons taught. A few of the too many to count are listed below for your enjoyment.
Ephesians 5:22 & 1 Timothy 2:12 (my daughters will definitely not learn to be subordinate to men)
Exodus 22:18 – Sorcerers, witch doctors…same thing, right?
Romans 1:27 – Live and let live? Guess not.
Deuteronomy 22:13-21 – Stoning a poor gal
Deuteronomy 21:18-21 – more stoning…poor guy
Numbers 15:32-56 – Don’t you dare break the Sabbath!
Genesis 7:21-23 – Animal Cruelty
BTW Daniel…I’ve been on a number of trips to help the less fortunate. Building houses for the needy, assisting flood victims with clean up efforts, etc. Guess what…no religious conviction required! (Fist pump!)
I apologize for posting some verses from the old testament. But according to our boy Jesus, they are still very much relevant.
“Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished. Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:17-19)
I worked in the same building with Doug Lund because the KELO radio studios were located inside their current building before being moved across the street. That was in the days when Doug would stop his drumming at the local pub next door, and run across the alley to do his nightly news stint as co anchor of the Big News, which we affectionately called, “The Big Snooze”. I appreciate that, even though I wouldn’t consider his comments about the billboard a powerful confession of his faith, or a useful defense for the Lord’s Divinity and authority, the seeds of Jesus were planted . . . and the comments that followed have been an interesting harvest. (Thank you for that Doug) Now, I could go on and on about how perfectly simple our God has made it, to not only believe in Him, but believe in His love for all humanity and His plan to save every soul from the due penalty of our sinfulness. Here’s what I’d rather do. I’d rather use this opportunity to gently arm serious and convicted Christians with some powerful scripture that should convince all of us that the very concept of atheism is not possible and God designed it that way. I’m not denying that any person can scream all day, at the top of their lungs, “I DO NOT BELIEVE THERE’S A GOD!” That’s a simple task, but fortunately for believers, the same canonical verses that lead me to the conclusion that Jesus is God’s offer for all to be forgiven, lead us to understand that God has already provided ample evidence of His existence. He has offered the world so much proof that Paul writes in the letter to the Romans, chapter one, verse twenty, “they are without an excuse.” Denial is simple, and it’s a default program for those that claim atheism exists, but design and order are irrefutable. Luck and chance make for great conversation, but science is an amazing friend to Christianity and we just tend to overlook it. I know, I know, science is all about observation. So for the sake of lonnggggg argument, I’m going to concede that. And I’m going to use that. Talk to the millions of people who belong to the world of “science”, as lab techs, medical personnel, etc. etc. who confess their faith in God because they are faced with what all of us have to admit to. Unless, of course, for whatever reason, pride, hate, rebellion, chasing immorality, we remain one of the “top of our lung screamers” about the absence of God. Won’t cut it folks. Already told you what God says, but let me add this. There isn’t one thing about the wonder of creation and the beauty of nature that is simple. NO WAY! (My turn to scream). The complexities of so many billions of organisms, plants, trees, animals and we humans, add to that the amazing balance of our breathable atmosphere, the perfect distance of our sun, (this list is endless) point directly to a Creator. To deny that is as foolish as walking with a friend to a beach, seeing footprints in the sand, and then telling your friend you don’t believe anyone has walked there. Well, Christian, be of good cheer, God has walked here . . . and the problem is not with believing in God, although that’s important. But that’s just the beginning of the kind of saving faith that our Father seeks from us. He had such love that He sent His son to die for us. And if we never believe that, admit that, and obey the good news . . . we can talk about God all day, at a hundred conferences . . . it will not save anyone. Not under this new covenant. God said there’s only one way to Him . . . that’s through Jesus. So here’s my desire . . . put me on the convention list of speakers. Invite me (if you are truthfully all about diversity!) and let me speak (NOT ABOUT RELIGION WHICH IS MAN’S INVENTION) let me speak of my Father, who loves every human being. He loves even those who deny His existence. They are not atheists. They are often really good hearted people who have never heard the good news taught in a way that is fully motivated by genuine, sincere love! I wanna be that guy. I want a place at the table. This is your opportunity to show that you are truly after diversity. Invite me to the conference to speak. I await your response. And at the risk of more persecution and rancor against me, I am praying to my Lord that you will say yes to my request! May God have mercy on us all! Love, Austin.
Austin…….well said…..Thank you for your comment!
Hey “Mrs Nelson”…what it REALLY means is, if there was no God, there would be no atheists!
To coach Zimbo/Z…googling a couple Bible verses to (try) to make your weak point is ignorant at best!!
And Bob Hausvik…your view is simply sorry!!!